To grade or not to grade - that is the question!

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bcbrasseur
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To grade or not to grade - that is the question!

#1 Unread post by bcbrasseur »

Hi there! Thanks for looking at my post!
My question is both twofold:
1. What would you guys be willing to pay for this raw unslabbed coin?
And 2. What do you guys think this would grade out as if submitted to PCGS?


Thanks! Have a blessed day! Happy stacking to all!
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SensibleSal66
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Re: To grade or not to grade - that is the question!

#2 Unread post by SensibleSal66 »

Hello and Welcome aboard !!
I would rather buy graded Morgan's because of all the Counterfeits out there and the Price range for this coin.That's just a personal choice .
Grading by Pics. is very hard . If I had to choose the appropriate grade, Id say at least MS-63+ maybe MS64 . It's a beautiful coin with almost problem-free distractions ( nicks, tiny scratches) .
Keep us posted if you decide to have it graded . : )
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Paul
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Re: To grade or not to grade - that is the question!

#3 Unread post by Paul »

Welcome
C.O.N.E.C.A. Wi State Rep
Fly-In Club Wi State Rep

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Re: To grade or not to grade - that is the question!

#4 Unread post by bcbrasseur »

SensibleSal66 wrote: Sat Aug 28, 2021 9:40 am Hello and Welcome aboard !!
I would rather buy graded Morgan's because of all the Counterfeits out there and the Price range for this coin.That's just a personal choice .
Grading by Pics. is very hard . If I had to choose the appropriate grade, Id say at least MS-63+ maybe MS64 . It's a beautiful coin with almost problem-free distractions ( nicks, tiny scratches) .
Keep us posted if you decide to have it graded . : )
Hey there! Thanks for the reply! I appreciate the warm welcome. I’ve been part of the youtube coin community for quite some years, but just decided to get active on here! I’m 99% sure it’s authentic - but I don’t like buying from online for that reason! It’s a relatively good deal though so I may snag it up! Was just curious what people on here thought it would grade at! 🤙🏻🤙🏻 Any opinions welcome!

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Re: To grade or not to grade - that is the question!

#5 Unread post by bcbrasseur »

Paul wrote: Sat Aug 28, 2021 10:03 am Welcome
Thank you!!Glad to be part of the board! hoping to bring a little bit of my expertise and passion to the community as well

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Re: To grade or not to grade - that is the question!

#6 Unread post by Triple C »

Hi and welcome! IMO, based on the pictures posted, it appears the coin has lost its luster. Therefore, may have been cleaned at one point. I would need to see it in hand.
For that reason, I would not buy it online either. Again, this is just an opinion.

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Re: To grade or not to grade - that is the question!

#7 Unread post by monsterbug1 »

Triple C wrote: Sat Aug 28, 2021 1:58 pm Hi and welcome! IMO, based on the pictures posted, it appears the coin has lost its luster. Therefore, may have been cleaned at one point. I would need to see it in hand.
For that reason, I would not buy it online either. Again, this is just an opinion.
think that is due to bad lighting

can see luster in 2nd set of images

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Re: To grade or not to grade - that is the question!

#8 Unread post by Triple C »

@monsterbug1...Perhaps it may be the lighting, but the darker patina, causing circles, around the stars on both sets of images tells me otherwise:
Screenshot_20210828-160731_Chrome.jpg
But again, this is JMO.

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Re: To grade or not to grade - that is the question!

#9 Unread post by monsterbug1 »

you may be right

may also be toning

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Re: To grade or not to grade - that is the question!

#10 Unread post by bcbrasseur »

monsterbug1 wrote: Sat Aug 28, 2021 7:29 pm you may be right

may also be toning
True! I wondered if it was toning as well. What do you think it would grade at if you were to guess?

Thanks! Have a blessed night!

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Re: To grade or not to grade - that is the question!

#11 Unread post by bcbrasseur »

Triple C wrote: Sat Aug 28, 2021 7:15 pm @monsterbug1...Perhaps it may be the lighting, but the darker patina, causing circles, around the stars on both sets of images tells me otherwise:
Screenshot_20210828-160731_Chrome.jpg
But again, this is JMO.
Im torn between if it is toning or not. I may just take a gamble on it... Im curious what you think it would end up grading at? I normally do mercury dimes so morgan grading is a newer art to me!
Thanks! Have a wonderful night!

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Re: To grade or not to grade - that is the question!

#12 Unread post by Triple C »

@bcbrasseur...here is a link to PCGS' grading standards:
https://www.pcgs.com/grades
If you click on each image, it displays the details they look for to grade the coin. You will notice luster on a coin is part of the grading standard.
There are also plenty of great books out there for you to read on grading Morgans.
Unfortunately, I can not give you an honest opinion from pictures, but my opinion should not matter anyway. What's important is how you feel about the coin.

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Re: To grade or not to grade - that is the question!

#13 Unread post by Daniel »

AU details. The coin was potentially cleaned in the past.

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Re: To grade or not to grade - that is the question!

#14 Unread post by bcbrasseur »

Daniel wrote: Sun Aug 29, 2021 9:03 pm AU details. The coin was potentially cleaned in the past.
Wow! FROM THE LEGEND HIMSELF! Seriously cant thank you guys enough! They were asking $350 for it and I think it isn't worth the risk. I am 75% sure its cleaned after deep inspection in which case I could find similar grades for 125-200 already slabbed. Thanks again for everything! Have a wonderfully blessed night! Happy stacking folks!

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Re: To grade or not to grade - that is the question!

#15 Unread post by Earle42 »

Agreed with Daniel.
BTW...some help:
The pics are not clear enough. But my initial guess is just machine doubling.

"
Here is more info concerning the nature of the grading companies to help people make better educated decisions.
Thinking of Slabbing? Make sure you understand the Facts...or You Could Lose Money.


1. People seem to think grading companies will examine a coin to see if they can find an error and then slab it as such. They ONLY GRADE coins and do NOT try to find errors on coins.

2. The grading companies are not a way that the majority of people, even those with a great deal of experience who know what they are doing, are going to be able to use in order to make huge personal profits. Many people start using grading companies thinking they will find a way to finance their hobby, but they learn a hard lesson quickly.

3. Watch some of Daniel's videos where he gets pieces back form the grading companies. Note even people who live, eat, breath, and deal coins for a living (like Daniel) can accurately predict what grade the companies will give. And...the "fault" (not really a fault) is in a widespread mistaken perception people get from being exposed to all the slabs being sold nowadays.

Coin grading companies are a business out to make a profit - this is why they exist. They use a system where (allegedly, but in reality its normally two) three graders look at each coin and give an opinion. The company videos showing the process make you believe this is a relaxed paced process of studying each coin. In fact one PCGS video shows a number of guys sitting around a table discussing what they think a specific coin should be graded as (on youtube somewhere - sorry no link). Uh uh.

If you take a PCGS graded coin slabbed as MS64, break it out, and resubmit it to PCGS, you are never guaranteed the same grade again. The slabbed coin might come back MS62 (bad day for graders), 63, 64, 65, 66 (great day for you!). This is b/c the process is all subjective: No scientific/verifiable standards or methods are used. Personally having talked with former graders (granted - its been awhile), the process is very rushed since they told me graders are paid by how many coins they can get through in a day.

But..this is all hearsay without proof. So...
Grading the Coin Graders

Here is another good read from someone there at the start of the grading companies:
Hobby negative impacts from slabbing companies

Also link to and read (download if you want it) the pdf link in my signature. The verifiable data presented shows trusting people have spent thousands of dollars on many slabbed coins that are not what the companies claims/slabbed the coins to be.

You don't have to throw in the towel over these companies...but education about the reality of them will put you on the right pathway to dealing with them in a legit way without losing money in the process.

And…if you just like to collect slabbed coins for what they are, which makes losing/making money from slabs irrelevant, then of course enjoy them!"
Common grading company shortcomings & resulting co$tly mi$take$ to collectors (using Kennedy No FG halves):
https://tinyurl.com/y7rksxu8

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Re: To grade or not to grade - that is the question!

#16 Unread post by OldSilverDollar »

As an Armchair Numismatics i would cautiously guess at AU58 to MS62.
Last edited by OldSilverDollar on Thu Sep 09, 2021 11:15 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: To grade or not to grade - that is the question!

#17 Unread post by MLC »

I would say AU55-AU58
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